November 2008 Feature Car

Canadian Poncho · A Poncho Legend!

November 2008 Feature Car

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

VERY cool car and certainly very deserving of the honour!

Now why oh why would someone order it with no ps or pb, and then put in cruise and an fm???!!!

Race car? Lots of highway miles in mind?

Very unusual combo, that is for sure!!

Way to go Hillar for preserving it as you have. Lots of guys would have cut it up or yanked the engine for a Chevelle or something. (Like I, or many others did long ago...)

Stephenzone · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

2drpost · Uber Guru

that is one very special b-body hillar.
they're only original once. wink

another great pick todd.

427carl · A Poncho Legend!

Todd; your ability, to select, a stunning example, of Canadian Pontiac products, is worthy of excessive praise! To repeatly, select, a superb example, of cherished autos, is uncanny...I am sure, as the years go by, you will be always looked to, as the "car of the month' Guru... if you need any advice, when you get to, the Ventura's confused

let me know Carl # 2nd

73SC · A Poncho Legend!

Big Thumbs Up Hillar. Looking forward to going cruising next season with the Green Monster.
One thing......yellow wires

......................................

-- Edited by 73SC at 22:27, 2008-10-31

cdnpont · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

When you actually spend some time and look closely at the front end of a 70', you'll be surprised at what you'll see. The lines and detailing are amazing!
Look at the way the hood meets the nose and bumper flush, the grille ribs are sweet, really fine! The gunsight running lights! GP like (sorry). It's a nice looking style that will really grow on you. When I bought my rag, I had a chance at a 70', but I chose the 69' only because that was the the first car I ever had. I think the 70' is even less represented, and has a really big potential to grow.

-- Edited by cdnpont at 22:42, 2008-10-31

SD 396 · Poncho Master!

I've said it before and I'll say it again. Awesome car! Bare bones....big motor. It doesn't get any better than that.

RDubya · Poncho Master!

It's a great looking car. Nice to see one of these big cars looking so good. Congrats on it being the feature car Hillar and kudos to Todd for picking it.

427carl · A Poncho Legend!

73SC wrote:

Big Thumbs Up Hillar. Looking forward to going cruising next season with the Green Monster.
One thing......yellow wires ......................................

-- Edited by 73SC at 22:27, 2008-10-31

I have, a nice set of Accel yellow wires! for free!! confused

SD 396 · Poncho Master!

Sorry for hijacking this thread

427carl wrote:

I have, a nice set of Accel yellow wires! for free!!

Are they for a big block or small block? Send me a PM

-- Edited by SD 396 at 10:26, 2008-11-01

427carl · A Poncho Legend!

SD 396 wrote:

427carl wrote:

I have, a nice set of Accel yellow wires! for free!!

Are they for a big block or small block?

heres a picture! they are coming off, as my Ventura arrived with new black MSD wires, and I want to put black ones,on the Chief... so they are BIG BOY BLOCK

sixtywagon · Uber Guru

VERY NICE!!! Never get tired of looking at that car!

Astro Jet · Poncho Master!

Once again, thanks for all the kind words guys. Here is a little bit more about my interest in Pontiacs and the Laurentian:

My association with Canadian Pontiacs started early. I was born in 1959 and my Dad bought a 1960 Laurentian 4 door hardtop, turquoise with white top from Hogan Pontiac Buick on the Danforth in the fall of 1959. It was the mighty 261 powerglide combo. We had that car until April of 1970. By that time I was already well aware about "cars". I read everything I could about them, coaxing my parents to buy me "car magazines" every chance I could get. I studied the model year changes for each make each fall, carefully cutting out all the new car introduction advertisements from the newspapers and the Canadian Magazine that used to come in the Saturday Toronto Star. I also developed an early affection for Pontiacs. My first plastic model kit was a 1967 1/25th scale MPC Bonneville 2 door hardtop. My Dad ended up building more of it than I did (I think he rather enjoyed it!) but within a couple of years I was doing them all by myself. I got virtually every Pontiac model that was issued between 1967 and 1972, oh what those would be worth now if I still had them! My Dad followed Alfred Sloan's prescription for moving up the GM ladder when he bought an Olds in 1970 and mother got a Buick (the car previous to the Laurentian had been a Chev) but I was hooked on Pontiacs.

In 1986 I bought my first, a 1972 Lemans Sport convertible. Other Pontiacs would follow, including a GTO and a Bonneville, but I was always fascinated and intrigued by the Canadian models, which you saw the most of at car shows around here any way. Custom Sports and Parisiennes ruled the day, not Bonnevilles and Catalinas! My cousin had a 1964 Laurentian 2 door hard top, again with the 6/pg combo that we had both essentially learned how to drive in at my uncle's place out in the country when we were 14. I educated myself as to the American model breakdown, joined POCI and GTOAA, but was disappointed at the recognition (or lack thereof) accorded to Canadian Pontiacs at these clubs. I decided I was going to get myself a Canadian Pontiac and start enlightening some of the folks from down south. In the late 80's I met CDN2PLS2 through the GTO club of Ontario and over the years, we managed to find/meet other fellow Canadian Pontiac enthusiasts. We both became interested in the rarity of the big block cars and others with unusual option combos, and Mark managed to track a lot of them down from coast to coast. At that point the aura of a big block Pontiac really started to grow on me. In the late 90's I found a 1969 Grand Safari wagon a couple of blocks from my home. It had been in storage for years and the elderly owner had pulled it out of his garage where it had been stored and it was just sitting on his driveway one day when I drove by. Ironically, he kept that car stored inside and let his daily driver, an 1986 Sedan Deville, sit outside in the elements. The wagon was Verdoro green (what else?) with the woodgrain on the side and it was powered by a 396 2bbl. It ran OK but the years of storage had not been kind to it and I sold it soon after as it was just too rusty and would have been too much to restore.

Around the same time I had met 427Strato and he was kind enough to invite me to his place where he showed off his very rare stash of Canadian ponchos. In addition to Laurentian, he has a loaded 1968 Beaumont SD and of course his 1968 427 4 speed Strato Chief which he bought brand new plus some other projects. It was one of those things, I told him if you ever decide to sell one of these cars......and lo and behold, in the spring of 1999 that call came. After a visit to the bank with briefcase to pick up the cash (they must have thought I was a drug dealer!) the Laurentian had a new home. I have always had a soft spot for plain jane big cars like Bis-Quicks, so this was a natural for me. As I mentioned in the Member's Rides Section, the car came with exactly 4 options: LS4 454, THM400, AM/FM and cruise control. No power steering or power brakes. Apparently the original owner had ordered a whole series of cars like this, to make for comfortable, relaxed cruises to Florida each winter. 427Strato reminded me that the dealer had made a mistake charging the original owner for the H78 tires on the original invoice, they came with 454 models apparently, so to compensate, someone made a phone call to Oshawa and the car "magically" had an AM/FM radio installed in it instead of the ordered AM radio. Don't you just love the good old days when it was actually possible to do something like that?

I took the car to the POCI convention in Buffalo that year, where it received a fair amount of attention. John Sawruk, POCI's official historian, spent a lot of time looking it over and we had a good chat about the northern variants of the arrowhead marque. I have not done much to the car since I got it, as Strato427 had it repainted recently before I purchased it, due the left quarter panel having been damaged. He knows much more about the history of the car before I bought it, so maybe he will chime in with some details. As it is, I understand I am the fourth owner. The interior and most of the car is quite original. The odometer showed just over 31,000 miles when I acquired it. I have often thought could that have been 131,000 miles, but the original interior is just in too good of a shape to believe that could be the case. The only major mechanical change I have made to the car has been converting it to dual exhaust. It took me a while to track down the correct exhaust manifold for the conversion as the original single exhaust version angled the exhaust pipe down for the crossover pipe instead of straight back for the dual set up. My ultimate objective is to take the car down to the pure stock muscle car drag race in Michigan ( http://www.purestockdrags.com/) where I'm sure a lot of eyes would be opened for those not familiar with what Oshawa could produce.

The PSMCDR allows for a vehicle to be equipped with any options that could have been ordered from the factory on that model, so I plan to make the upgrades allowed to get it up to the maximum performance level that was available in 1970, the LS5 version of the 454 which was rated at 390 hp. To that end I will be swapping the cam for a Comp Cams Extreme Energy version that is close to the LS5 profile and installing larger pushrods and guideplates as well as "massaging" the factory quadra-jet. The other area due for a major upgrade is the rear end which is currently a 2.56 peg leg. A 3.31 gearset and a posi should make the 12 bolt a lot more productive on launches. I also have a pair of addco sway bars and a set of gas shocks to go in. Probably most of the front end bushings will get replaced as well. Once all of that is done, I will finally have an incentive to paint the engine and detail the engine compartment! One area I am still in a bit of a quandary over is the wheels. I love the poverty cap look, but I also have a set of rally wheels with the flat caps ready to go with a set of tires already mounted, including a pair of meaty 275/60-15s for the rear. Even though they were a 2 + 2 option, I think they would look good on the Laurentian. Maybe I will just leave the trim rings off for a poverty look, sort of like a Judge where they left the trim rings off. And just a note of clarification to Todd's note above, in 1970 the total number of all B bodies equipped with the LS4 (including all models Strato Chief thru Grande Parisienne) was 221. Talking to various people over years with respect to similar models, I would say the total number of Laurentians with the LS4 in 1970 is probably less than a dozen.

To close off, alot of car enthusiasts would never expect something so big, so plain, so unassuming (and so ugly, depending on your opinion) to be so fast. I think that is a big part of the car's appeal. I would love to go back in time and order a whole bunch of cars like this, I would have a whole fleet of them! The fact that it is a unique and rare part of Canadian automotive history just makes it that much better. We don't have much in the way of cars that we can truly call our own, but that unique set of circumstances that dictated the production of Canadian Pontiacs just seemed to unleash the most creative minds at GM of Canada and the cars that they managed to "invent" out of parts bins just seemed to have the right combination of everything, style, looks, performance, reliability, cost, etc. I am lucky to be one of the custodians of these unique vehicles and plan to do my best in spreading the faith!

Thanks again to Todd for starting this great site so that we could all come together here to share and enjoy our unique Canadian hobby!

-- Edited by Astro Jet at 00:16, 2008-11-02

-- Edited by 73SC on Sunday 17th of October 2010 09:09:50 PM

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

Excellent writeup Hillar, in spite of the fact I had to go get my reading glasses that I seldom wear!

Way to go for preserving this car...

SD 396 · Poncho Master!

Very nice writeup Hillar. Again I say it is a fabulous car. "The wolf in sheeps clothing".

67SD396 · Poncho Master!

Wow, great car and an incredible write up! Thanks Hillar for sharing your car and your story.

2drpost · Uber Guru

thanks for telling the story behind it hillar. is that a remote mirror? i also have one of those harveys decals to mount on the bel air.

eeluddy · Uber Guru

Thanks for sharing the story and pic's of this rare beast.

Astro Jet · Poncho Master!

69 belair wrote:

thanks for telling the story behind it hillar. is that a remote mirror? i also have one of those harveys decals to mount on the bel air.

No, just a regular mirror. I am thinking of getting the matching one for the passenger side. It's amazing how used to them you become when they are on your daily driver.

I also have the Harvey's decals if anyone is interested. See my post in the Canadian for sale section.

Taylor55 · Poncho Master!

Congrats on owning the car of the month and for writing such an informative story! You are very lucky to own a big block Canadian Poncho especially one equipped so plain with no ps and pb. Do what you want to do with the car but just remember to keep all the original parts. Al

seventy2plus2 · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Very good write up Hillar.

I disagree with SD 396's comment "The wolf in sheep's clothing". The 454 emblems indicate "The wolf in wolf's clothing". I did the same engine treatment as Hillar plans to do, but I lowered the compression to 9.3:1 for today's octane ratings. Still plenty of power, but just not quite the same as the original 10.25:1, so Hillar's should really fly with that cam and original compression ratio. The big chrome nose on the '70's takes a while to get used to, and at one of the POCI conventions John Sawruck indicated the nose was originally to have an endura strip down the middle of it. I can't remember why the plan was aborted, something to do with it either being a GM strike year, or something like that, but it would be interesting to see if John Sawruck had some old drawings.

Astro Jet · Poncho Master!

Clint, I have been running Sunoco 94 with no problems under the stock set-up. Were you having pinging issues? What fuel were you running. How did you lower the compression, thicker head gaskets or dished pistons?

seventy2plus2 · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

The 350 in my gold car is still original 10.25:1 and is ok using premium and the timing backed off a bit. We don't have Sunoco out here, and it's hard to find 92 octane, let along 94 (select few Mohawk's and Husky's here have 94 ethanol blend). Esso & Shell premium is 91, reduced a few years ago from 92. Back in the day, pinging was a problem on the 454, so when we rebuilt it we used dished pistons to lower the compression. Heads remained stock with all new valves and springs, etc, and normal thickness head gaskets. I use my cars for long trips, and hunting around for a specific gas often isn't an option. I figure while the compression ratio was dropped, the hot cam puts it back to around stock hp figure.

Pontiacanada · A Poncho Legend!

Super nice car ... love it ... it would be cool to smoke the rear Goodrichs a bit!