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Canadian Poncho Homepage -> Canadian Poncho -> General Acadian/Ventura Discussion -> the on going saga of the rat wagon
Post Info TOPIC: the on going saga of the rat wagon
Stephenzone


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the on going saga of the rat wagon
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i'm plugging along on the 2+2 rag but it hasn't stopped me from sourcing parts for the rat wagon. i had full intensions of using a s10 clip on the front of the wagon but after fabbing everything up the motor was sitting to close to the drivers side and interfering with the brake booster. its why i haven't done anything in a while. and put it on the back burner. well i've always wanted to do a rat rod and was contemplating this 40 GMC cab i had access to. to make a long story short i've scrapped the 40 project and will do the wagon as a full blown rat, after the rag. which was my original plans.

wagon as she started




the motor. 88 454 with 4 bolt mains (now replaced w/ 427)



454 in mockup. now i know why gm offset everything to the passenger side



saggy 4 speed (now gone replaced with super T10)



as she sits last week with her new tailgate. bob and i traded



narrowed 9 in



mounted. notice incorrect tailgate



one piece that i got in jersey



the reason why i got the one piece. not a single bolt came undone. everything seized tighter then you know what.



fenderwall exit headers for a big block for a first gen. quite the score



new front end. we are talking gasser. i'll use everything except the frame.



I picked up my rear flank trim that bob had cut and rewelded to fit the new configuration of 2 dr. heres bob modeling it up against his 65 invader wagon. what a trip yesterday to go get it. we spent a extra 2 hrs on the 401 yesterday because of a fuel spill



i'm not really gonna do anything on it for now just archive the parts till the shop is clear of the 2+2.





-- Edited by Stephenzone on Thursday 15th of September 2011 07:53:11 PM

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sTevE

55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
Astro Jet


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Lookin' good Steve!  It will be well worth it when it's done.  I like your ideas for originality.

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Hillar

1970 LS4 (eventually an LS5) Laurentian 2dr hdtp
-and a bunch of other muscle cars...
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4SPEED427


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I will check. I think my friend used an S10 clip on his 65 Acadian wagon.

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1966 Strato Chief 2 door, 427 4 speed, 45,000 original miles 

1966 Grande Parisienne, 396 1 of 23 factory air cars (now converted to a "factory" 4 speed)
Stephenzone


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the 454 w/ the tunnel ram and 2 600 hollies is sitting in my jeep for now. I have a 70 LT1 slated for the jeep.



-- Edited by Stephenzone on Thursday 15th of December 2011 09:54:28 PM

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sTevE

55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
Beaumont4008


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So thats what your using the leaf springs on. Thats going to make a great gasser. Looking forward to watching this one progress.  biggrin.gif

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Stephenzone


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v8nova64 wrote:

i want to gasser my 64 but don't know what axle to use under it. What axle and leafts are you using? will it need shortening?


front end is off a 56 chev truck. front track stock on my car is 56.3, yours is 56.82. the chev truck is 57.5.  i can live with 1/2 in on either side. the frame is the same wideth as the front clip so i'm going stock measurements for everything. for steering, s10 box ahead of axle w/ link to the passenger side

 



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sTevE

55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
Stephenzone


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v8nova64 wrote:
so you are going to mount the leafs to your stock front clip? Can i use my rack and pinion steering system. It is currently mounted to the stock cross member. If i use a straight axle can i mount it directly to the axle or should i make a new cross member that hangs in line with the axle and wheels but mounts to the stock sub frame?

 


if you look at my previous pics and post, you will note there is nothing on my stock front end that is salvagable or was kept. i'm making my own squared tube frame using the measurements of the stock chassis. I would use your front clip getting rid of the inner fender but bracing the lowers to the stock upper inner fender location. probally find lots of info for this stuff over at steves nova site. Its where i got lots of mine. and yes keep your rack and pinion, not sure how to mount it.

 



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sTevE

55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
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Stephenzone


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your front clip is roughly 34 1/4" wide from outside to outside and approx 37" long. my 56 chev truck frame is 34" but the leafs are 43" long so i'm gonna have to get them shorten if i want to stay within the frame geometry. rack and pinion is probably the best way to hook up a i beam. but i'm keeping the rat rod theme and going with a old saginaw box. look at maybe a mid 60 gm van for a 5 bolt i beam. track width is very close.

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55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
Stephenzone


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not working on it but still sourcing parts. Santa helped me out this year.



just kidding fred gave me the cardboard cutout because he knows i collect that stuff.


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55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
68sd


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why isnt he working? Lazy !!
,look hes just sittin back and  dinking a coke and letting you do it all!

-- Edited by 68sd on Friday 21st of January 2011 10:49:33 PM

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gparis7


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Love what you are doing with this wagon; can't wait to see the finished product (may be a while with the convt and all??)

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Stephenzone


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started assembling parts for the 427. 40 over 454 block, forged crank out of a 366.



gonna rename the rat wagon thinking franken wagen

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sTevE

55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
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Stephenzone


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got my leafs back from durham spring. these are the guys to take your leafs too or if you need u-bolts made. they are awesome and car guys to boot. they made the leafs on my 55, 10 years ago plus the u-bolts also did up the leafs & u-bolts on my jeep a couple of years ago. for the wagon they shorten the leafs to 34" from 41". i've been bothering the gasser guys for measurements for the last 6 month or so



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sTevE

55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
jonathanD


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Great work steve can't wait to see it when the new sub frame is mounted =)



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crazyj


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Nice wagon. So are 366 and 427 cranks the same ?



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Elroy


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yep and 396 too

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dualquadpete


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That's interesting on the cranks!!! Farm inplement dealer has a chevy 8 ton that they put a "new" Target Master 366 in it 10 yrs ago never fired it up, there it sits, "SEIZED" solid!!!! DUH!!!!!!

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67SD396


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crazyj wrote:

Nice wagon. So are 366 and 427 cranks the same ?

 They are the same stroke length but they aren't 100% the same.  The 3rd counter weight is thicker and heavier for the 427 crankshaft.  As well, most of the crankshafts out of the trucks didn't have cross drilled mains.  The truck cranks are supposed to weigh more than the passenger car cranks too.

......so they are the same but different.   I do believe they are interchangable.



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Stephenzone


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......so they are the same but different.   I do believe they are interchangable.

 I do know of 2 running 454 with 366 cranks in them. my info is that all BBC share the same crank bearings.

on another note. i'll be sending in the block to get aligned honed and have the bores checked soon



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55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
crazyj


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So what's with the internal/external balance ? I can't remember which is which, I thought that the 454 was internal and 427 was external and what about the rest of the dirty RATS ?



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Stephenzone


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396/402/427/BBC & 366/427 tall decks are internal balanced & 454 and larger BBC are externally balanced.

read this on team chevelle. made sense

The reason the 454 is externally balanced is that there is not enough room between the crank centerline and the bottom of the pistons when they're at BDC, to fit a large enough counterweight, without moving the wrist pin up and thereby compromising the ring package (in the factory's opinion, at the time it was originally designed in 1970 or so), either by spacing the rings too close together, using narrower rings, making the oil ring overlap the pin bore, or a combination of those.

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sTevE

55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
crazyj


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Makes sense.....thanks.

Did you buy that 9" already narrowed ? This 63 Ford wagon that I just picked up, I wonder if it has a 9". A friend of mine has a low milage 427 from a 69 Vette , I don't have any numbers yet . What is it worth if it is indeed what he claims it is ?



-- Edited by crazyj on Saturday 21st of May 2011 12:11:24 AM

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gparis7


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I love what you are doing with this car. Can't wait to see how it turns out once you get back to it. 



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427carl


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That much engine MAY make it unsafe disbelief     

Way to much Power to weight ratio...  

May be dangerous at 120mph on the 401  

Be careful



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Stephenzone


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hey carl i'll try to keep it under 80 mph on the 401

latest update. made the front frame. shorten the leaf. should have it as a rolling chassis by tomorrow nite





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55 GMC, 70 Pontiac 2+2 rag
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