Making plans for the '58 this summer!

57poncho · Uber Guru

RE: Making plans for the '58 this summer!

94smasher · Veteran Member

It was in the bottom of my Mom's dresser...apparently she'd forgotten it was there. It's now proudly hung on a wall at my house.

sixtywagon · Uber Guru

Very Kool!!! You should consider displaying it with your car at any events you attend!!!!! Love the '58's

94smasher · Veteran Member

Still working away. Guess there's no turning back now!!

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While it's torn down, I did a complete clean/repaint/detail on the engine compartment (Needed it desperately)

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She's looking pretty good now...ready for re-assembly.

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Unfortunately, my buddy that's been giving me a hand with this messed up his back, so I gotta keep going on my own. I'll git r' dun one way or 'nother!!!

94smasher · Veteran Member

Well, here we are, summer is winding down....and I've learned a couple things. I've learned who my friends really are (not in a good way), and I've learned that if you want to make any kind of POWER, don't bother with Chevy garbage!! I knew I shoulda stuck with my instinct and put a real Pontiac mill in it. I'll keep messing with it, but I have a feeling this motor will be on Kijiji or at the bottom of the nearest lake next year. furious

4SPEED427 · A Poncho Legend!

That sounds bad....

You can make good power with a Chevy small block. I don't want to prod too hard but if you're willing to elaborate, possibly you can get some help for it here.

rabbit64cs · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

installing your cam at 12' straight up with both dots,,,that's an American Pontiac term, i've always installed Chevy with the dots pointing at each other, this phases the cam to number 1 compression stroke.

static initial timing of '15 is pretty excessive, the stumble and running hot even lead me more to think the cam is into phased correctly.

hope somebody else chimes in, but I'm leaning on the cam ....what is your compression like on all cylinders?

-- Edited by rabbit64cs on Friday 16th of August 2013 09:44:52 PM

rabbit64cs · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

you don't sound happy.... I seen the pile of parts you had on the floor, no reason your not making 350 hp?

so.. all things considered, is it the seat of the pants feeling? is it a dog.

gears, tires, tranny , cam install... tuning... we could go one, but everything has to be purpose built to work as a combo.

sorry for your frustration,, but Like Carl said,,, maybe some bench racing here on the site might help to get back on track..

biggrin

I make a seat of the pants 300 hp with a home built 327 , cam matched to the gears , tires and weight of the car,, with the glide it's no neck snap out of the hole.. but pulls like a freight train 1800 rpm to 5700 all day long. surprises a lot of people..

94smasher · Veteran Member

Well, I know I still have a bunch more tuning to do. The last piece I have to go in is a higher stall converter. The cam doesn't seem to like the stock one. The rear gears are stock (I'm guessing 3:23 or so, maybe a little less) I know these are not ideal, but it's what I have. As it stands, no, I'm not happy at all. It is a complete dog. Even holding it in gear up to 5000 rpm at speed, it can't get out of it's own way. It sounds nasty as hell at idle, but it's all noise...and makes it hard to drive 'cuz I have no vacuum for the power brakes now. Seat of the pants guess, I'd put it at 200 hp or less. I was hoping the engine combo would work, at least, since it all came from Edelbrock in the one package. The cam is installed straight up, with the marks on the timing set both at 12 o'clock (since this is how I was told it should be so #1 is #1 and not #6) Initial timing is about 15*...any more, and it won't start, any less, and it just backfires and stalls. I jetted up to 72's in the primaries and 79's in the secondaries (700 cfm Holley) cuz it seemed quite lean at first. Now it might be a little rich, but at least for now I feel safer that way. I don't even know where to begin with the massive stumble/dead spot on acceleration. Did I mention it runs hot?

94smasher · Veteran Member

I've done a ton of paint/body work for a mechanic 'buddy' of mine, with lots of promises for all the help in the world when it came time to build this engine....and what do you know, all of a sudden "the girlfriend has this and that planned, it's kinda far to drive out to your place, etc. etc." Nothing like a double kick in the nutz, but at least I'm learning fast on engine building/tuning...because I'm certainly not getting much help these days....

rabbit64cs · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

A quick thiing to try , move your plug wires 180' because you have phased the cam out 180'.

mark #1 for starters.. so instead of 18436572..... put #6 where you marked #1 and run 65721843 . this effectively times the spark 180' out from where you started.

something to try?

I'm just thinking out loud, maybe I'm way off?? but If the cam was installed 180' out , rather than #1 being at the top of the compression stroke, it could be at the start of the compression stroke. Not sure if it would even run, being out 180' , but with the 15' static timing, maybe it's possible.

I know with a 283 years ago , I put the 300 hp cam in it with an edelbrock intake. It was a dog until it hit 2800 rpm, but then it screamed.. I over cammed it,, added a stall to compensate.

-- Edited by rabbit64cs on Saturday 17th of August 2013 09:16:40 AM

94smasher · Veteran Member

I honestly haven't done a compression check. The engine had maybe 5000 miles on it before I started all this, internally it still looked pretty new...so it's not the kind of thing I thought of. I have a feeling you might be right about the cam timing, but honestly, if that's what it is, it'll be next year before I do something about it...really lost my momentum for taking this thing apart again. But the more I think about it, it's running a lot like my GTO did when I had a bad timing set in it. It put the cam timing off, and it ran, but not well at all...hmm... :(

94smasher · Veteran Member

Hey, it's appreciated...I'll take any and all input I can get at this point!

rabbit64cs · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

I meant ,, 180' out would be at the start of the intake stroke....

but you get the idea...

94smasher · Veteran Member

gah...tomorrow it'll be going up to my buddies shop for some more parts...we'll see where this goes. Had to boost it to get it running tonight, never had that problem before, either. Then I made the mistake of running up and down the street to remind myself of just how bad it was. There'd better be a cam timing problem...cuz if that's what 400 Chevy hp (edelbrock's claim) feels like, I'll take 300 Pontiac hp over that any day. Like the difference between Clydesdales and donkeys.

rabbit64cs · Canadian Poncho Superstar!

Did you try flipping the plugs 180' like I suggested? Do it at the distributer,it'll take you 10 min.

94smasher · Veteran Member

I still haven't been able to try anything yet...car is still at the shop just waiting to get headers hooked up...they're installed, running open headers (sounds ridiculous) but yeah...over a week for 2 little pieces of pipe....this is going well. I have my doubts about getting it back before the weekend.

94smasher · Veteran Member

Well, the cam is in the right way, I've tried different distributors, carbs, jets, etc. This thing is just a dog. Maybe it would be a good motor for a little camaro with a stick or something, but in my car, it sucks. Officially the LAST small block chevy I will ever waste my time/money on. I have a feeling the car will be sitting for a while now...until I can save back up all the money I wasted to try and build another motor for it. Which is the exact opposite thing I was trying to do. I wanted to get her back on the road where she belongs....but I guess I screwed that one up, too.